SavageRifts.com

Posted: **Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:33 am**

So lets talk about how handling drones should be considered. Specifically we are talking about the variety of drones such as armed and unarmed drones for military service. Not the cheap $600 dollar ones we have in our garages.

So what ideas do you have?

The Solution cannot be: "Steel everything from this copyrighted book and post it on the web."

Posted: **Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:40 am**

So, my big question relating to Borgs is, Since the brain /body interface is pretty much telepathic control of a drone, can that direct control be transferred to a surveillance drone or even a giant robot? I dont mean RC here as much as full Telepresence.

Posted: **Mon Oct 02, 2017 11:12 am**

@Billy Bong - Interesting idea of Telepresence.

I was considering more RC control via uses of Cybernetics
Droid Controller Suite

Core Electronics Package
Signal Booster
possibly a Droid Interface Package (new)

Non Combat Droid - Survellience

Audio Package
Optics Package
Signal Booster
Range Data System

Posted: **Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:21 pm**

BILLY BORG wrote:So, my big question relating to Borgs is, Since the brain /body interface is pretty much telepathic control of a drone, can that direct control be transferred to a surveillance drone or even a giant robot? I dont mean RC here as much as full Telepresence.

I could see that as an option fitting in with fiction. Basically remote piloting without the effort of sitting in a control station.

PS: This is weird, a ton of chatter in hangouts, but nothing people want here?

Posted: **Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:24 pm**

From a game balance perspective, the notion of limited actions needs to be preserved.

Personally, I prefer a combination of Edges and Gear (and most Gear can be figured as a Cybernetic equivalent, with all the advantages and disadvantages that go along with that).

First off, baseline rules:

Operating a drone remotely normally inflicts a -2 to all actions taken using the drone, unless the character has the Drone Jock Edge. In addition, actions taken through a Drone are just like actions taken by the main character for purposes of Multi-action Penalties.

(Someone a bit better with such things can stat out drones, their capabilities and weapons systems, the range and security of control, and the costs thereof--and yes, in any decent sci-fi setting, "drone jamming/jacking" is going to be a thing.)

Drone Jock (Professional)
Requirements: Novice, Agility d6, Smarts d6, and Boating, Piloting d6 OR Driving d6
Drone Jocks are experts at maneuvering a drone via a remote interface. They ignore the -2 penalty such remote action normally inflicts. This Edge applies to any Drone you have the appropriate operation skill at d6+ for.

Drone Ace (Professional)
Requirements: Novice, Drone Jock, Agility d6, Smarts d6, and Boating, Piloting d6 OR Driving d6
A Drone Ace may spend their personal bennies to allow a Drone under their control to soak damage. This uses the Drone's Vigor die. The Pilot must have the appropriate skill type at d6 for that Drone.

Drone Master (Professional)
Requirements: Seasoned, Drone Ace
You may roll the operation skill (Boating, Driving or Piloting) for a drone you control and fire one weapon system without taking a Multi-Action Penalty.

Posted: **Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:49 pm**

Here is a Spam dump of the google chat in case people want. I did not format or edit, only copy and paste.

Cut and paste spam

Posted: **Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:53 pm**

My only input on this is that a drone seems like a fine idea. A horde of drones, however, seems like a very bad idea on multiple levels.

Posted: **Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:54 pm**

I like this. My favorite Shadowrun character was a rigger that would sit several blocks away from the action and provide support in various ways. I would absolutely build a Rift rigger. (I like the way that sounds too.)

IMO there needs to be several categories of drones available. Recon with good sensors and stealth, Light Support with limited weapons and armor but the ability to provide distractions or cover (audio/visual tricks/tests-of-will or smoke/barriers), and Heavy Support with a bit more armor and heavier weapons but much shorter flight/drive time because of the power requirements.

Posted: **Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:56 pm**

In rifts, they don't do drones as much as they robots; There is a drone controller device that is arm mounted, another that is a vehicle mounted one, and another that is cybernetic. The CS has the cybernetic one, Naruni offers the vehicle mounted controls (which controls a network of weapon and sensor drones - check out Mercenaries), and Northern Gun offers the arm mounted one that can be mounted in Power Armor.

Here's how I did the Savage version of the Skelebot Interface Implant:

Skelebot Interface Implant (1): This piece of cybernetics connects to a built-in cyber radio that translates voice commands into coded transmissions to the Skelebot. This allows the Robot Specialist to order any Skelebots under his command without the need for specialized external equipment. Range is limited to 150". This piece of cybernetic equipment is Top Secret, only made by the Coalition and is available only by assignment. (Strain 1; Not for sale)

Honestly, it needs a bit of work, since I intend for it to allow the players to use the command edges on the skelebots.

Short version: Create robot/drone extras and use the Command and Sidekick rules, depending on the capability of the drones.

Posted: **Mon Oct 02, 2017 8:16 pm**

Now the real question:

Can Telemechanics be used to steal control of drones?

Posted: **Mon Oct 02, 2017 8:49 pm**

Alecto wrote:Now the real question:

Can Telemechanics be used to steal control of drones?

If course

Posted: **Tue Oct 03, 2017 6:45 pm**

Freemage has a line on the edges... I would go even further to just retrapp Beast Bond and Beast master for drones. Then you are done. You want a small drone that has flight and a laser, use the falcon or hawk stats and toss a wilks on it with a d6 of shooting. Maybe a bit of armor.

Posted: **Tue Oct 03, 2017 7:01 pm**

Pender Lumkiss wrote:Freemage has a line on the edges... I would go even further to just retrapp Beast Bond and Beast master for drones. Then you are done. You want a small drone that has flight and a laser, use the falcon or hawk stats and toss a wilks on it with a d6 of shooting. Maybe a bit of armor.

That would be a good fit for a self-operating drone with an AI unit. But it's not so good a fit for one that is pretty much just an extension of the operator. (Beast Bond/Beast Master are for 'pets' and other trained beasts--which an AI Bot would certainly fit.)

And note: The SciFi companion has basic robot rules that would be very suitable for self-operating drones. You could even create a mod (Remote Controlled) to turn the robot into a direct control drone like others were looking for. It would probably be a cost decrease to the base cost of the Bot, since it wouldn't be relying on an AI to operate, and wouldn't have Smarts or Spirit dice.

Posted: **Tue Oct 03, 2017 7:01 pm**

Pender Lumkiss wrote:Freemage has a line on the edges... I would go even further to just retrapp Beast Bond and Beast master for drones. Then you are done. You want a small drone that has flight and a laser, use the falcon or hawk stats and toss a wilks on it with a d6 of shooting. Maybe a bit of armor.

Genius!

Posted: **Wed Oct 04, 2017 9:58 am**

They'd have a Smarts score actually. Just not a high one.

Posted: **Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:19 am**

High Command wrote:They'd have a Smarts score actually. Just not a high one.

Would a remote-controlled drone have a Smarts score? They would be using the operator's intelligence. If you wanted a very basic AI to handle moments when it's no longer being controlled, then I don't think you need actual Smarts for a simple contingency instruction like, "Stay and record all events in your area" "Attack everything in your area" or "Go to [co-ordinates] and land/self-detonate".

If the Drone is going to have decision-making capacity when it's not linked to an operator, of course, then it gets Smarts and Spirit both, and would need a different Mod for switchable control.

Posted: **Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:59 am**

I think you need a Smarts score for scenarios where the drone may need to react to something outside the operator's instructions. It would be similar to animal smarts allowing limited binary type decision making.

Posted: **Wed Oct 04, 2017 9:06 pm**

Freemage wrote:
High Command wrote:They'd have a Smarts score actually. Just not a high one.
Would a remote-controlled drone have a Smarts score? They would be using the operator's intelligence. If you wanted a very basic AI to handle moments when it's no longer being controlled, then I don't think you need actual Smarts for a simple contingency instruction like, "Stay and record all events in your area" "Attack everything in your area" or "Go to [co-ordinates] and land/self-detonate".

If the Drone is going to have decision-making capacity when it's not linked to an operator, of course, then it gets Smarts and Spirit both, and would need a different Mod for switchable control.

As I said, 90% of all drones in Rifts are actually robots. Like Skelebots. So yeah, Smarts and Spirit. The few that aren't are also dumb as bricks.

Posted: **Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:55 am**

Two different level of Bots
(a) Radio (RC) controlled
(b) AI controlled

Radio (RC) controlled drones/bots

Less Expensive
Short Range
Fewer Bots/Drones Controlled
Easier Repairs because of Mechanical Repairs and no coding or programming
Lower Smarts and Spirit scores

AI controlled drones/bots

More expensive
Long Range
More Bots/Drones, Less Control Required
Harder Repairs due to Specialized, Coded, and Programmed parts.
Higher Smarts and Spirit scores (required for atonomy)

Posted: **Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:04 am**

An RC drone wouldn't have a Spirit or Smarts attribute at all unless they had some sort of autonomous functionality. With RC drone hacking would be a straight up opposed skill roll with the operator. I'd propbably go with Kn Electronics or Kn Computers for that.

For AI drones I'd just use Smarts to resist hacking attempts. The smarter the drone the better it would be at resisting.

Posted: **Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:12 am**

Radecliffe wrote:An RC drone wouldn't have a Spirit or Smarts attribute at all unless they had some sort of autonomous functionality. With RC drone hacking would be a straight up opposed skill roll with the operator. I'd propbably go with Kn Electronics or Kn Computers for that.

For AI drones I'd just use Smarts to resist hacking attempts. The smarter the drone the better it would be at resisting.

I'd say Kn Computers for hacking, Kn Electronics for jamming. Jamming just shuts down active control, while hacking lets you actually issue your own commands. RC Drones might also have "Hacking Security" as a mod, which would impose a penalty on attempts to subvert control.

Posted: **Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:39 am**

Freemage wrote:
Radecliffe wrote:An RC drone wouldn't have a Spirit or Smarts attribute at all unless they had some sort of autonomous functionality. With RC drone hacking would be a straight up opposed skill roll with the operator. I'd propbably go with Kn Electronics or Kn Computers for that.

For AI drones I'd just use Smarts to resist hacking attempts. The smarter the drone the better it would be at resisting.
I'd say Kn Computers for hacking, Kn Electronics for jamming. Jamming just shuts down active control, while hacking lets you actually issue your own commands. RC Drones might also have "Hacking Security" as a mod, which would impose a penalty on attempts to subvert control.

Definitely a good mod for military and security style drones. Illegal for civilians, of course.

Posted: **Tue Oct 10, 2017 8:17 am**

Would you use MARS Operator IF for these Drone/Bot Operators?

Could you reskin the Shifter (Savaging Your Favorite Rifts Ideas) for use with a Drone Operator? Their abilities to summon (Bind the Summoned/Master Summoner) specifically.

Posted: **Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:41 am**

If using MARS I'd suggest adapting either the Power Armor Soldier Package or the Robot Armor Operator package replacing the armor with a suitable drone (perhaps 2 depending on how powerful they were.)

Basing combat drone stats on existing power and/or robot armor seems pretty straightforward to me.

Hover cycles could be adapted for recon style drones (make them smaller, maybe one mod slot, use speed/armor stats, add sensor package, etc.)

Make them battery powered to give them a dependency (recharge every 24 hours.)

Posted: **Wed Oct 18, 2017 3:54 pm**

So, i plan on statting up the original content models that I am making. I wanted to get feedback on autonomous weapon turrets. The vehicle is basically a large Motorcycle/Robohorse with a turret on its rump. Basic Robohorses already have a pretty sophisticated AI. Does anyone see a problem with the AI controlling the weapon, acting on the riders voice command? Yes it is a free attack but equipment gives a lot of different bonuses.

This is not so much a drone question as it is an autonomous
system question.

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